WingMakers Revisited (In the Fullness of Time)

Many of you may have already read this from the original WingMakers website, but I am bringing it up again for those who may not be familiar with this very well-defined description/translation of information found on the optical disc found in the 23rd chamber of the Ancient Arrow Project.  I make no apologies for its length. You will fully understand when you find yourself resonating so much with the information that you feel like weeping with joy.

Things we have forgotten are awakened as we prepare for the very natural process of Ascension that is absolutely for ALL living expressions of Prime Creator.

"All of life, even the so-called evil and negative
aspects, are part of an incalculably complex, but single-minded,
cosmological organism devoted to the transformation of evolving life
forms so that they can comprehend their intimate connection with all of
life, and their oneness with Prime Creator. This is the fundamental
system that overarches all other systems of the multiverse, and it is
for this fundamental reason that life exists."

WingMakers: Ancient Arrow Project

From the Desk of Jeremy Sauthers, Ph.D.
Director of Special Projects, ACIO

Classified Document No. 040297-14X-P17AA-23

To all Labyrinth Group Members -- FYEO


Based on all available research of the Ancient Arrow
time capsule, WingMakers seem to represent themselves as a future
aspect of the human race from a time approximately 750 years in our
future. They represent a version of humanity that has comprehension of
the universal systems that govern existence, or at least the laws of
time and space. This understanding permits the WingMakers to travel
back in time and interact with humankind at various points in its
evolutionary pathway.

I would speculate that WingMakers have--throughout
history--been variously referred to as angels, gods, spirit guides,
and, in some instances, extra-terrestrials. They imply that they are
adept at subtly interacting with humankind in order to evolve its
understanding of the cosmological environment in which life evolves and

After successfully decoding the first of 23 segments of
the optical disc left in the 23rd chamber, I will share a small excerpt
of their introduction as it were:

"You may refer to us as WingMakers. We are most often
confused with angels, though we are actually quite human--just a
future, perhaps more advanced, version. Humans, conditioned as they
are, seem unable or unwilling to comprehend the vast diversity of
living beings amongst the cosmological planes of existence, and so,
somewhat as a defense mechanism, lump together what are distinctly
unique beings. The angelic kingdom is a different species of life when
compared to the human or the WingMakers' format of existence.
WingMakers exist outside of time's focus, while their human,
extraterrestrial, and angelic counterparts exist within, and, to
various degrees, are bound by the principles of time. Our uniqueness
stems from our ability to operate independently of time while remaining
human with all the physical and mental characteristics therein."

WingMakers and their existence appear to be woven into
virtually all cultures and civilizations upon earth, and appear to be
commonly represented through mythological and religious stories
. Their
stated purpose is to be the Culture Bearers bringing the seeds of
language, art, philosophy, scientific reasoning, and spiritual
understanding to the human race throughout time. Apparently, they
perform this duty without recognition, preferring to be unknown until
the time is ripe to present themselves and their specific mission. I
think we have to assume, based on the available data, that WingMakers
operate at the pinnacle of human existence since they are interactive
time travelers.

Their interaction with humans seems limited to select
individuals, who, during their dream state are more accepting of new
ideas and insights. These insights often filter into the contactee's
waking life in the form of inventions and sudden discoveries. In rare
instances, I believe WingMakers will even physically appear, but owing
to the time-shift from which they come, their bodies would appear to be
constructed of light, and their communication, if there was any, is
most likely telepathic.

According to the records of the Ancient Arrow site, it
was the WingMakers who originally seeded life upon earth and
facilitated life's evolutionary leaps and biological transformations.
They (and we, according to them) originated from the star system
Pleiades. They came as the human genotype, and brought with them a
library of genetic codes that, through experimentation, produced the
human species, and of course, most other forms of life on earth.

Through their time-travel technology they have planted
time capsules from their future time, which they hope will provide a
sense of connection to our future selves and an understanding of human
destiny. They seem to be particularly interested in helping present-day
humans build a global culture.

One of their more outlandish claims is that they
essentially seeded the concept of the Internet for the purpose of
developing this global culture. They believe the Internet will somehow
become the platform upon which their time capsules will be fully
launched into the mainstream of the world's citizens. They predict (and
I use this word with chilling precision) that by the time their final
time capsule is discovered in 2023, the Internet will be the focal
point of the new global culture and it will become the gateway to a
connected "intra-galactic, digital nervous system".

They refer to this global culture as the Sovereign
Integral, which is difficult to translate into English. However, Drs.
Stevens and Whitehall believe it means that the global culture of earth
will be both developed and distributed through the Internet, and that
this global connectivity will enable earth to be integrated with other
planets in our galaxy through an extension of this network. They use
the example of earth as being a node on a cosmological network, and the
Sovereign Integral is simply the earth's global culture presented to
the galaxy in a way that it can harmonize with the other planetary

I know this seems like science fiction, but then, I
remind each of you that we are talking about a group of advanced humans
who have developed interactive time-travel technology that has alluded
us for over 30 years. The artifacts in the AA time capsule, and indeed,
the time capsule itself, are clear evidence of this group's advanced
technology, and I believe their predictions should be taken as more
than mere speculation or clairvoyance.

Our biggest concerns, relative to the time capsule
itself, have to do with the accuracy of our translations. Their
language incorporates visual art, music, poetry, and various
hieroglyphs and symbols that collectively communicate their thoughts
and ideas. In other words, their language is a multidimensional puzzle,
and we are convinced that they are communicating much more than mere
words and standard ideas.

A recent issue that has arisen concerns project
security. Several of our linguistics specialists have become obsessed
with decoding the messages in the time capsule, and have been asked to
leave the project out of concern for their stability. Anything -- no
matter how subtle -- that could compromise the project's security, has
been dealt with in an expedite manner.

However, this heightened sense of security also has its
peculiar issues. All of you are aware of the Judas Effect, as described
by Col. Richards. When security reaches a certain tempo and pitch, its
breach is almost predictable, because those in the inner circle cannot
effectively deal with the pressures. Unfortunately, because of the
breadth of this project, we have had to bring in personnel with
clearances as low as 6x.

We are using our memory protocols with good results, and
document-management systems have never been more secure, thanks to the
Minyaur technology, but nonetheless, we all have to remain extremely
vigilant to maintain utmost security befitting a 12x project. In the
time I have been the Director of Special Projects, I have never seen a
project worthier of our collective vigilance.

Enough about my concerns. Let me go into some detail about our findings to date.

If our interpretation is accurate, the WingMakers have
placed 6 additional time capsules strategically located on the planet,
which will be discovered in a certain sequence, probably by ordinary
citizens entirely unaware of what they are stumbling upon. We assume
these "discoveries" are actually orchestrated by the WingMakers. At
this time, it is impossible to determine whether these locations can be
discerned through the existing Ancient Arrow site. There remain dozens
of petroglyphs and hieroglyphic symbols yet to be deciphered -- any
number of which could point the way to the other time capsules.

From everything we are able to discern, there appears to
be no intended threat by the WingMakers to national security, social
order, or economic stability. However, all we know at this time is that
the Ancient Arrow site is imbued with wall paintings and various
artifacts, most of which have yet to be understood by our technicians
and decoders. Our only success to date was the unlocking of the optical
disc that appears to be their "calling card". At best, we know how they
want to be thought of. Culture Bearers is the closest definition we
have been able to apply to their intentions thus far.

Dr. Stevens is quite convinced that the WingMakers
interacted with a pre-historic Native American tribe known as the
Anasazi, which were known to inhabit that area of northern New Mexico.
Carbon dating places the paints used on the cavern walls at
approximately AD 840, which coincides with the flowering of the Anasazi
culture. It is interesting to note that, according to Dr. Stevens, the
Anasazi Indians mysteriously disappeared about 200 years later. We
cannot say if there is any connection or cause for alarm.

Having decoded most of the text contained on the optical
disc, we have concluded that if their intentions are hostile,
WingMakers could, at their complete discretion, time-travel to any of
our military installations and deliver a fatal blow to national
security. Their signature technology appears to be time-travel, not
weapons of mass destruction, and as we all know, there is no imagined
technology more advanced than interactive time-travel.

We are trying to ascertain if any of the artifacts could
also be a communication or signaling device that would draw the
WingMakers back to our time. The odd thing is, however, that they could
be visiting us every day and then re-writing history so we forget their
visit. It is a virtual certainty that they are aware of our discovery
of the time capsule, and may be aware of much more. It is even
considered a possibility that they are helping us in the discovery
process. There have been several events where a certain insight came
upon the research team that seemed inexplicable, but then, it is easy
to be paranoid when dealing with such an awe-invoking technology as

The materials within the time capsule seem to indicate a
race of cultured people who are relatively small in number. If our
deciphering tables are as accurate as we believe them to be, WingMakers
are a select tribe or faction of humanity in the middle part of the
28th century, who have combined science, philosophy, and art into a
unified "religion" and language. They are unique among their peers, and
it would seem they are the equivalent of a secret society, not unlike
the Chakobsa (perhaps even like us -- though they're much better

I will provide another excerpt from the optical disc,
which provides a bit more insight on the mission of the WingMakers.
This particular excerpt was translated from the text of the optical
disc, and represents one of our first breakthroughs in deciphering
their language with alphabetic granularity. Of course, we cannot say
with any certainty that the translation is one hundred percent
accurate, but we believe it is close.

"Culture-building is the primary focus of the WingMakers
because it is understood to have such a significant bearing on the
world of spirit and cosmological transformation. Culture-building, by
definition, integrates the values of individualism with the value of
oneness. It is the goal of life, as it is related to a species, to
evolve itself where it can be conscious of its diverse perceptions and
expressions, and integrate them into a cohesive, all-inclusive culture.

"Humankind deeply desires such a culture; a global
culture that recognizes and appreciates its constituent parts. This is
one of the primary reasons that communication technologies have evolved
so quickly upon earth in the 20th century. Through these technologies,
the global culture can be more rapidly developed and experienced. And
through this global culture, humankind will become increasingly
sensitive to the spiritual inclinations of oneness. Not only oneness
within the human species, but within the whole of life that embraces
and envelopes the human species.

"WingMakers are aware that humankind is intricately
connected to all other species and forms of life within the universe of
wholeness. This connection is known as the Mind of God. It is more than
simple inter-dependency as depicted in a food chain or ecosystem. It is
the accumulative knowledge of Prime Creator achieved through absorbing
the life experience of all life forms. This all-encompassing knowledge
is shared willingly to all life forms, but is only comprehensible to
those who have achieved an ability to step out of time.

"All of life, even the so-called evil and negative
aspects, are part of an incalculably complex, but single-minded,
cosmological organism devoted to the transformation of evolving life
forms so that they can comprehend their intimate connection with all of
life, and their oneness with Prime Creator. This is the fundamental
system that overarches all other systems of the multiverse, and it is
for this fundamental reason that life exists."

I think you will agree that these do not seem like the
words of a warring race or hostile force. Indeed, they seem indicative
of a philosophical group who has a very specific mission and the
technology to see their mission through to completion. There are over
8,100 pages of text embedded within the optical disc, organized in 23
sections to coincide with each chamber of the AA site. Thus far, we
have been successful in translating about 440 pages or about 5%.

What we have translated is very encouraging. There are
no references to anything that could be construed as hostile or
aggressive in nature. To the contrary, its content is similar to what
is included in these selected excerpts. It is very philosophical in
nature; there are references to the new physics of time-travel and some
interesting exposition about how the individual soul interacts with the
multiverse or cosmological order. Much of the poetry, music, and visual
art appear benign, but seem to have a powerful effect on those of the
research team who were developing the translation tables.

We are still testing our hypothesis in this matter, but
our preliminary suspicions are that the WingMakers use an encoded
language that has an effect on the subconscious mind of building
holistic sensory perception in the cerebrospinal system. Which is to
say that two of our best 12x linguistic experts claim to have improved
mental acuity, visual perception, intuition, and creative skills as a
direct result of working on the project. It is as though the very
process of deciphering their language equips the mind with a new form
of intelligence that can best be described as holistic and penetrating
at the same time -- characteristics we have been trying to genetically
engineer for over 15 years in the AdamSon Project.

While we would like to retain the same experts on the
project to expedite the translation, we have made a difficult decision
to rotate the linguistics and decoding team every six months in an
effort to reduce the undesirable side-effects of this new form of
intelligence, which is zealousness. It seems that as the researchers'
new intelligence is activated or somehow generated through the process
of decoding the encoded language of the WingMakers, they become fervent
believers in the perspective of the WingMakers and they lose their
objectivity, and, as a consequence, become security risks.

We have used the MI technology to remedy this situation
with the effected personnel, but as we all know, this technology is not
perfect, and memory reconstruction has been known to be successful
under deep hypnosis. For the time being we are holding this course of
action with extreme caution, and all effected or potentially effected
personnel under 14x are under constant, invasive surveillance.

Other contingencies -- less favorable to personnel --
are being discussed and will be used only under specific scenario
triggers, which are still in the process of being agreed upon. Bill
Ornstein, who most of you know, was the technical lead on the AdamSon
Project, has proposed an excellent array of research tests that, we
hope, can pinpoint the causative factors -- both physiologically and
psychologically. I have already signed off on the budget and determined
it as a 12x classified project reporting directly to me. Dr. Ornstein
is developing the project's scope and sequence documentation and it may
be ready for distribution at our next meeting.

Now, back to the WingMakers, we believe their
time-travel technology may be a synthesis of human consciousness and a
bio-computer whose neural net is able to adjust dimensional sequencing
with such precision that they can open, and, more amazingly, maintain a
time window for an indefinite period. One thing all the scientists
agree upon, is that the Ancient Arrow site was not created in a week's
time. Dr. Arnison concludes that the site would have taken -- even with
advanced excavation technology and a crew of 50 workers -- a minimum of
three months to create.

The 23 chambers of the AA site are carved using some
form of a sound resonator technology, but in order to hollow out these
chambers without collapsing the canyon wall would have required a slow
and careful process. Also, there is no evidence of rock-chips left in
the area, so it would have required them to bury the excavated rock
some distance away as there are no suitable sites nearby to dispose of
that amount of refuse.

We believe one of the artifacts left behind in chamber 6
is an example of their sound resonator technology used to carve rock
with sound frequencies. We have been successful thus far in activating
its lowest frequencies, and we are quite certain that it is not
equivalent to our ELF technology, and has limited military
applications. However, we will continue the testing to see if we can
access its high frequency range where it is assumed the tool cuts
through rock or even metal alloys.

None of the artifacts uncovered appear, to our
investigation, to be a time-travel device. However, as said earlier, it
is premature to draw closure on the peculiar nature of these artifacts.
We are still searching for technologies, or combinations of
technologies that will permit us to unlock these spectacular and
enigmatic artifacts. We are relatively certain that these artifacts
pose no threat to national security. They have all been thoroughly
examined and are benign in weapons' grade material, at least, as we
know them today.

Molecular scans show evidence of trace amounts of human
DNA -- not on the casing of the artifact, but inside. It is assumed
that the artifacts are composite technologies using molecular-scaled
CPUs, but we've been unable to ascertain how to disassemble any of them
without potentially destroying them. Some of our research staff are
growing impatient, and advocate sacrificing one of the artifacts for
the purpose of looking inside in order to assess re-engineering
pathways and enable us to better understand the remaining 22 artifacts.
But that decision needs to be weighed very carefully. Up until now, we
have remained patient. I think, however, that the time is approaching
when we need to take additional risk.

In total, there are 23 artifacts, one in each of the 23
chambers. We have kept all of this technology within the Labyrinth
Group; no private-industry partners have been exposed to these
technologies thus far. However, preliminary discussions are ongoing
with Bell Labs' Cogent Group, and Incunabula Documents have been
distributed to its Director of Research, Dr. Vaunderman. His team is
expert in sound resonator technologies, and have been used by the ACIO
in three previously classified projects with great success. Budgets are
being developed over the next 30-days, and it is assumed that research
would commence shortly thereafter.

If BST is hidden in any one or combination of these
artifacts, it is our top priority to access this technology and learn
how to apply it. However, as we all know, the likelihood an advanced
race -- human or otherwise -- would ever disclose its time-travel
technology is extremely remote.

One more excerpt is probably relevant to this briefing
memorandum. Again, it is from the same section of the optical disc
referred to earlier, but is a more recent translation.

"It is the drama of life--as it unfolds in human
culture--which reflects inwardly upon the cosmological multiverse.
Human culture deeply effects the spirit world, and as your Einstein
predicted, ripples touch the entire cosmos. It imprints upon the world
of spirit a vital energy. An energy of love, passion, involvement,
creativity, and perhaps most important, a sense of personal expression
and bold individuality. This energy is precisely what balances the
energy that drives a species to seek oneness with its Creator.

"The energy of the multiverse is like a giant funnel
that delivers a species into the Mind of God, the only vessel of Prime
Creator, who is otherwise unclothed and invisible. This funnel creates
an overbearing drive for oneness and re-connection with the Mind of God
in a developing species. In this drive for oneness, beings can forget
their individuality. Their unique life experience could be forsaken for
oneness if not for the experience of the physical, mental, and
emotional involvement in building a separate, species-based culture.

"WingMakers have strategically placed time capsules upon
earth that, when discovered, will facilitate the development of a
global culture that represents humankind and earth, rather than a
specific geography, race or philosophy. In parallel with this goal of
culture building, is the goal to introduce new paradigms of existence.
In the case of our first time capsule, it will introduce indisputable
evidence that a time-shifted civilization visited earth and left its
calling card. It will also--because it is the first one to be
discovered in contemporary times--lead to the discovery of additional
time capsules placed elsewhere on the planet by the WingMakers.

"These time capsules will eventually act as a
communication bridge between contemporary humans and their future
selves. The WingMakers will act as the responsible elder brother who
returns to help the next two generations of humans build a global
culture that prepares the human species to take its next evolutionary
leap. This new leap will include the design and development of a whole
new species based on the human genotype and soul.

"The underlying purpose of existence is to expand and
diversify life forms in order to enable Prime Creator its fullest
expression and perception of life. The human species is but one of a
countless number of sentient life forms that unerringly grow and expand
in diversity throughout the cosmos. It is but an atom in the Body of
the Collective God. Within its consciousness, humankind is limited by
its perception of the universe of wholeness by its over-reliance on the
five senses. These senses are powerful forces that focus the human
instrument on a separate reality much like a diver's mask can focus the
diver on the underwater world.

"The time capsules we have left behind provide
technology, art, and philosophy, indeed, an entire language that will,
in time, develop two additional senses of the human instrument. The
genetic composition of the human species was conceived to have 7
senses. You have, in recent times, begun to refer to the 6th sense or
the sense of intuition. There is a 7th and most powerful sense, and it
is the sense that is linked to time-travel, which is linked to space

"However, before these two additional senses of the
human instrument can be fully activated, there must be a global culture
representing a unified and fully integrated earth. Our mission is to
develop the specie's genetic capabilities to include these two new
senses while simultaneously ensuring that a global culture is developed
that unifies the human species under one leadership, one culture, and
one pre-eminent philosophy.

"If this sounds like an improbable goal, we can assure
you of its success because we live in the time when it is so. And if
you need further proof of our mission, simply learn our language, and
you will have your proofŠ"

If the AA site is indeed a massively constructed time
capsule from our future selves, it is the single most important
discovery we have made. Which is why this project is being handled by
the Labyrinth Group exclusively. Even our interactions with the Cogent
Group have been entirely code-Fresnel compliant and our SOP
misinformation procedures are being used to further safeguard the
project's anonymity. Complete procedures have been developed on how
best to inform other departments of the military and government (if
deemed necessary), but at this time, no one outside of the Labyrinth
Group's directorship level and scientific core have knowledge of the
nature and implications of this project.

The entire project has been given a security envelope
consistent with its 12x classification. Contingency plans for
misinformation campaigns targeting public, media, government,
intelligence, and foreign relations, as well as personnel risks, have
all been developed and are ready to deploy should scenario triggers
require their deployment. All ACIO directors should be fully aware of
these contingency plans and their related scenario triggers because I
need complete, absolute support if it becomes necessary to execute a
contingency without discussion. Fifteen has already signed-off on
delegation authority. A full oral briefing will be presented on May 5th
in the Orion Room at 8am, which will provide a complete description and
provide a forum for your questions. Please come prepared with
appropriate questions and plan for an all-day session. (Email RSVP to

This briefing memorandum is to ensure all of our
directors are informed on a consistent basis. Questions should be held
for the May 5th meeting. Thank you.


J. Sauthers

Managing Director, Special Projects ACIO

File: P17AA:41298 Brief Memo

--- Post removed at author's request ---

JoyAnna's picture

but that's nothing new for me Smile. Is this long post from WingMakers from the original site that is posted on the TT portal, or is this from the altered website at Despite all the long, involved correspondence between you, Fred, James and Mark Hemple, I still feel somewhat ill-at-ease about the authenticity surrounding the history of this site. Maybe it doesn't matter who says what, or where good words and ideas come from, but I guess I'm just enough of a Doubting Thomas to want to know the source for what I read. I feel a lot of frustration about this because, like so many of us, I was so moved by the WingMakers materials presented in the TT course, only to have the authenticity called into question as the discussions followed. I was somewhat surprised to hear Michael St. Clair refer to the WingMakers because I have read his book and came to trust his opinions (that's why I posted to alert others to the Camelot discussion. I just would like to know where to find the original of the material you just posted.


rovin's picture

Perhaps I watch too much sci fi but I'd like to think that the rule of non-interference is true. That future civilisations would come back to plant time capsules or make any other adjustments doesn't ring true. For me, the point of this is to absorb wisdom wherever it is found. Continuously look inside for truth and realise that profound truth may lie in the perception of subtlety and what is in the here and now. As one, Rob.

maryc's picture

Dear Chris,

Thank you for posting this. i agree with Rob on this subject,and Elizabeth...

I can embrace the wisdom contained,without proving the wingmakers. The truth is in here....waiting to be remembered.The wingmakers material is,for me,a reminder. Love,Mary

ChrisBowers's picture

J. Sauthers says at the end of that correspondence,

"Contingency plans for misinformation campaigns targeting public, media, government, intelligence, and foreign relations, as well as personnel risks, have all been developed and are ready to deploy should scenario triggers require their deployment"

When I received that email from Bill Ryan so promptly yesterday (remember, they have a note by their "email contact" that says sorry for not getting back to you if we do not due to all of the email we receive, but know that we read every email) I was affected by Bill calling WingMakers a myth (for some reason I cannot explain) more than when Mark and "James" or "Mahu Nahi" or whatever "he" is calling himself lately, said it was a myth.

Don't get me wrong. I don't care if the Ancient Arrow Project is a myth or not in the end, I just get ticked when people start dicking around with others for no apparent good reason, which still leaves open entirely the very real possibility that disinformation tactics as per Standard Operating Procedure are being utilized, so here is my most recent logical assessment of the matter:

The WingMakers/Ancient Arrow story begins as an incredible stumbled-upon discovery of some caverns with 23 chambers in an ascending spiral (like DNA), each with their own individual artifacts dating back to approx. 840AD, all except the 23rd chamber which contained an optical disk that could not have come from the same time period, nor the present time period, thus prompting the NSA to take over the site and designate it top secret, and form a special branch (ACIM) which led to the Labyrinth Group, complete with all the official designations one would expect to find on correspondence originating from a typical state-sanctioned militant authority.

Now all of that fits perfect into a well-written science fiction story, but if a writer wanted really wanted readers to discover some universal truths (as the official story now goes on the new WingMakers website), then why not be straight up front at the very beginning of the story and forego the very real possibility of disillusioning/betraying the reader for no good reason if it was a myth/science fiction from the very beginning? There is a very large community of science fiction readers out there that would follow the fictional story as far as "they" wished to take it, so why wait to say it is a myth after setting it up so apparently authentic at the beginning? That is just mean spirited and makes future claims of benevolent intent very suspect - i.e. it doesn't make sense.

And then, after all of this senseless, insensitive and reckless leg-pulling, we are then to believe (first time shame on you, 2nd time shame on me) that the admitedly mythological "James" or "Mahu Nahi" (what does that mean? Gotcha?) sincerely and solemnly has something "real" to genuinely offer in his alleged "assigned capacity" to any and all comers who are not intellectually lazy, but are sincerely willing to do the work of extracting the universal truths to be found in the staged myth, thereby further developing their 4D brains to operate on an even higher level than before. We can get that from many other sources not calling themselves myths, like Ra Law of One.

Does anyone else have that vivid image of Lucy holding the football for Charlie Brown? I have been known to succumb to gullibility in the past and may not be the sharpest tool in the shed, but something definitely does not add up here, so which "lie" are we to believe now??? I have a hunch that this character "James" is from somewhere in the scientific community running a program based on his own agenda of where he sees science going in the future, and he very well may be right! In fact, I am inclined to agree with his views on where he sees science going and its merging with religion and philosophy, but somebody is not being straight with us about all of this and that tends to erode credibility.

This leads me to believe (via common sense and occam's razor - "All other things being equal, the simplest solution is the best.") that the original story may very well be true, but I am inclined to drop it until I have new evidence that "James" is unable to refute. Another reason I suspect the WingMakers story may be true is due to a book called, "The People of the Secret" by Ernest Scott, a very erudite study of the very real possibility that we have been guided periodically by advanced beings/civilizations all along, and this is how it is done throughout the universe/multiverse throughout time.

This would make the WingMakers Ancient Arrow Project a very normal and matter of fact, "oh that" occurance in the final analysis....

Love, Chris

P.S. Oh, JoyAnna, almost forgot, the original post is from the original website, complete with official header and footer info one would expect to find on a correspondence of an official capacity. My burning question - why not tell the reader right up front he/she is reading a very wonderful science fiction story????? Something just does not make sense, but I sincerely hope that Elizabeth is correct for the sake of all who frequent the new WingMakers website.....

JoyAnna's picture

I had just looked back and made the comparison to reassure myself that you were quoting from the original site ( . That makes my "thank you" even stronger. I can agree with Elizabeth and Rob and Mary, that while we can take inspiration from all sources, it is extremely important to me personally to be aware of where information is coming from and of any possible ulterior motives behind the words. Coming from a Christian background, even Jesus said, "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.…" (I John 4:1). In the case of the WingMakers, I cannot know, at this time, if this is true or a myth, but it seems to be quite within the realm of possibility given all we are learning about science and our galaxy. The WingMakers Philosophy makes my heart sing, so I take that part into my repertoire of inspirational material, but feel a huge sense of "Warning" and "Beware" when I look briefly at As you have pointed out above, if James, whoever he is, is truly involved in Sacred Transformation, then he needs to quit playing games with the public. We have enough of that going on already.



Berry's picture


I am not the rigorous logician that you are nor do I have the time to probe for evidence as you have so wonderfully done. But my gut feeling (that natural lie detector that our Creator gave all of us) is that this is indeed another case of  our U.S. Coverumup's disinformation tactics to misdirect and confuse or mislead people.  Just as was disclosed in the video I posted yesterday about ETs-The greatest Story Ever Denied.   It seems to me that there is too much integrity in the original Wingmakers site for it to have been a created myth and especially as it was not designed to produce a profit.  What would be the purpose of expending so much time and effort on a project like this if it was not going to provide someone with a payback of some sort?

I do appreciate greatly your dedicated work to dig out the truth within this story.  And I look forward to the time when you will confirm that it is in fact authentic, even as the infomation within the Gizeh Pyramid and and the Mayan Calendar proves to be reliable and incredibly accurate.

I just had a thought (who me?) .  Has anyone taken the time or effort to check the Wingmakers out with applied kinesiology?  I would think that someone who has expertise with the process could determine quickly the truth or falsity of the information.

Love and Light,



ChrisBowers's picture

I wrote to Bill Ryan of Project Camelot to thank him for the interview they (Bill and Kerry) did with Michael St. Clair because it made me go back to the original WingMakers website for a bit. The following is my email to him and Bill's response to me.

I was listening to part one of your interview with Michael St. Clair and he mentioned WingMakers in context of changes we need to be ready to align ourselves with during these transitional times. It prompted me to go back to the original website (where some of the most authentic and powerful material is still presented) and copy/paste this for you, even though you are probably already in possession of this, but just in case you're not, it is such a wonderfully fitting reminder of the assist we have to draw upon if we simply pay attention to our helpers..... Even though I read this quite a while ago, it seems even more fitting these days and I hope it makes your day as it did mine!

His response: Many thanks, Chris -

This is Bill here. Kerry may reply separately if she has time, but she has the movie rights to the WingMakers material and knows Mark and James from the WingMakers site. It’s a myth - technically speaking - but like all great myths, contains profound and important truths.

Very best wishes,

Bill and Kerry

I will let all of you decide what to make of all of this..... Love, Chris

ChrisBowers's picture

Great idea Berry! Anybody out there have reliable experience in PK work???

I am posting Anne's experience with Dr. Anderson of the ACIO (Advanced Contact Intelligence Organization) from the original WingMakers website to revisit the very clear sense of authenticity it so powerfully conveys (at the same time notice how brilliant the story is if it really were science fiction for the sake of objectivity and "fluid intelligence"). Again, it is long, but well worth reading again if you are still seeking to understand the Ancient Arrow story, as well as that part of the ongoing story that has been going on for thousands of years (if the story is true).

Anne is the journalist who was originally contacted by Dr. Anderson
(the defected scientist from the ACIO) to get the story of the
WingMakers out to the general public. In this section are some of her
initial notes related to her early discussions with Dr. Anderson. It is
Anne's goal to update this section with new information as soon as she
is able
(I wonder what happened to Anne, Dr. Anderson and their proposed updates???).

Notes from Dr. Anderson of the ACIO
Written May 27, 1998 by Anne

What follows are some of my notes taken while in earnest
discussions with Dr. Anderson from the ACIO during the last 2 weeks of
December 1997, before he disappeared -- at least off my radar screen.

Dr. Anderson is about 6 feet tall, perhaps 170 pounds,
has relatively long black hair, and by all appearances, seems of
Peruvian descent or at least from somewhere in South America (though I
never asked). I would guess he was about 50 years old with just a few
tinges of gray hair.

He called me out of the blue one day in mid-December
1997. His opening line to me was something like, "My name is Dr.
Anderson, and I have secret information about the future of humankind
that proves the existence of time-travel technology"
. Being a
journalist by profession, it got my attention, though the whole time I
spent on the phone with him my skeptical nature was in high gear. I
always assume stories of a fantastical nature are false in reality,
though the perceiver can think them to be true. And so that ís how I
operated with Dr. Anderson. I felt him to be genuine and sincere, but
probably misguided or in error.

However, he was convincing enough to secure a meeting
with me, and so we met a few days later at a coffee shop near my home.
He didn't fit my stereotypical view of a scientist. He was much more
sophisticated and even elegant in his demeanor, and looked as much like
an executive of a Fortune 100 company as anything else. His charisma
and articulate manner immediately impressed me, and I sensed that he
was not a man of mental instability prone to wild claims.

He told me that he had no recollection of his original
parents, and that a high-ranking member of the Advanced Contact
Intelligence Organization (ACIO) had raised him, so his entire life was
involved in one way or another with the ACIO
. His adoptive father
raised him as a single parent. He had been told that his mother had
died from breast cancer shortly after he had been adopted when he was
only about 2 years old. He had attended the best private schools, and
additionally had been provided with special tutors, which he later
learned were from the ACIO

For the most part he grew up a fairly normal boy until
the age of 14 when he came under the formal tutelage of his future
colleagues from the ACIO. By the time he was 17 he had left school and
decided to pursue an internship at the ACIO, though he said that at the
time, it was simply called the NSA Special Projects Laboratory and was
an unacknowledged department of the NSA
. His internship lasted for two
years and he never pursued a formal degree at a University, though he
claimed to have knowledge about physics and the life sciences that is
far in advance to the curriculum of the best universities

He stated that he believed himself to have possessed
average intelligence until he began his training and internship at the
ACIO. He said that they had technologies that stimulated certain
aspects of the central nervous system and brain that increased raw
intelligence by as much as 500%
(note from Chris: now consider what "James" is saying on the new website about increased cognitive abilities if the truths buried in the "myth" are studied and practiced - mixing truth with lies is not necessarily a bad thing, but it sure makes me go hmmm). In addition, he claimed that there was
a genetic implant technology that increased the ability to memorize and
retain information to the point where the entire scientific core of the
ACIO had perfect photographic memory. This enabled them to build their
group intelligence beyond the genius of any one individual
. These
technologies -- he claimed -- were of extraterrestrial origin derived
from a friendly source that had been visiting earth for thousands of
, but had arrangements with the ACIO dating from 1959 that were
secret even from our government and its intelligence agencies.

The alien race, which he called the Corteum, had
infiltrated the ACIO in 1958
, and though he wasnít specific about how
this occurred, he did say that the Corteum are still working with the
ACIO to seed technologies on earth that are superior to our native
technologies. The technologies to accelerate and enhance intelligence
were the first technologies to be transferred and these were to enable
the ACIO scientists to assimilate and utilize subsequent technologies
that the Corteum brought to the ACIO. In exchange for these
technologies, the Corteum were provided safe haven within the ACIO
intelligence structure

In other words, the Corteum were permitted access to all
of the information systems of the ACIO, which are considerable
according to Dr. Anderson. They were also able to use the facilities of
the ACIO including their laboratories, considerable land holdings, and
scientific brain power. This unfettered access to ACIO intelligence
provided the Corteum leaders with insight into the structure of world
government, where the power centers were, who the real leaders were,
and how critical decisions were made for the worldís people

According to Dr. Anderson, the Corteum are benevolent
and had no ulterior motives
to take over the earth and rule in
dictatorship. In fact, they were much more interested in establishing
diplomatic ties to the various world governments through the United
Nations at the appropriate time, which was considered to be shortly
after the year 2011
. The existence of the Corteum was kept from the NSA
and even most ACIO personnel were unaware of their existence (though I
donít know how this was accomplished).

Within the ACIO, there are 14 distinct levels of
security clearance. Those who are at level 12 and above are aware of
the Corteum Technology Transfer Program (TTP), and they, according to
Dr. Anderson, are about 120 in number, and are primarily in India,
Belgium, and the United States
. There are only 7 who have level 14
clearance, and they are the Directors of Intelligence, Security,
Research, Special Projects, Operations, Information Systems, and

These Directors report to the Executive Director, who is
known simply as "Fifteen"
, which is the unique classification that is
reserved for the head of the ACIO. Fifteen, in the eyes of Dr.
Anderson, is the most powerful human on the planet, and what I think he
meant by "powerful" is that Fifteen is able to deploy technologies that
are well in advance to any that our worldís governments have access to
However, Dr. Anderson portrayed Fifteen and his seven Directors as a
benevolent force
, not a hostile or controlling force.

The eight people who comprise this inner sanctum of the
ACIO are in possession of radical technologies that have been part of
the Corteum TTP. However, there were also other extraterrestrial
technologies that had been derived from recoveries of spacecraft or
other alien artifacts
, including various discoveries contained in
ancient texts that had never been revealed before. All of this
information and technology has been collected and developed within the
ACIO scientific core -- all of who possess clearances of level 12 or

This scientific core is called the Labyrinth Group, and
consists of both men and women who have utilized the Corteum
intelligence accelerator technologies to their advantage, and have
created a secret organization within the ACIO
. When Dr. Anderson was
explaining this to me, it got so complicated that I asked him if he
could draw me a visual diagram of how all of these organizations

The Labyrinth Group consists of all the personnel within
the ACIO that qualify for levels 12, 13, and 14 clearance. Fifteen is
the leader of this most secret organization
. It was split from the ACIO
to enable secrecy from the NSA and lower ranking members of the ACIO
which would facilitate the Labyrinth Groupís agenda to create its own
applications of the Corteum TTP. The Labyrinth Group is in possession
of the pure technologies derived from the Corteum TTP. It takes these
technologies and dilutes them to the point where the ACIO or Special
Projects Laboratory will sell them to private industry and government
agencies, (which includes the military)

This secret organization is the most powerful
organization on earth in Dr. Andersonís opinion, but they do not choose
to exercise their power in a way that makes them visible
. Thus, their
power is only discernible to their members. For about 40 years they
have accumulated considerable wealth apart from the NSA's oversight.
They have managed to build their own security technologies that prevent
detection from intelligence agencies like the CIA or KGB
. They are, for
all practical purpose, in total control of their agenda -- perhaps this
is what makes them a unique organization.

Dr. Anderson had a clearance of level 12 and was still
kept from vital information that only the Director level was aware. And
it was assumed that even Fifteen kept vital information from his
Directors, though this was never a certainty. The symbol used by the
Labyrinth Group is four concentric circles
. Each circle representing a
clearance level (12, 13, 14, 15), and each circle had a unique insight
into the agenda of the Labyrinth Group, and its coordination with the

Fifteen was an enigma to everyone within the Labyrinth
Group. He had been a physicist before he became the Executive Director
of the ACIO. He was a renegade because he never interacted with the
protocols and the political environment of academia. He operated
outside of the institutions and was selected to be part of the ACIO
because of his combination of brain power, independence, and relative
obscurity within scientific circles. He was one of the first to make
contact with the Corteum and establish communication with them
. The
Corteum essentially appointed Fifteen as their liaison to the ACIO, and
Fifteen became the first to utilize the intelligence accelerator
that the Corteum initially offered.

These technologies not only enhance cognitive abilities,
memory, and higher order thinking skills, but also enhance the
consciousness of the individual so that they can utilize the newly
gained intelligence in a non-invasive manner. Meaning, they don't
exploit their intelligence for personal gain at the expense of others
This apparent increase in both Fifteen's IQ and ethical consciousness
caused him to create the Labyrinth Group in order to retain the
pure-state technologies of the Corteum TTP from the NSA.

What technologies are released to the NSA are diluted
forms of the pure-state technology
, which are significantly less potent
in their military and surveillance applications. What I expected to
hear from Dr. Anderson was a secret organization of intelligent, evil
elitists -- individuals intent on exploitation and control. Why else
would they want to hide beneath the cloak of such incredible secrecy?

The answer, according to Dr. Anderson, was surprising.
The Labyrinth Group view themselves as the only group with sufficient
intellect and technology to develop a specific form of time travel
technology. They are essentially focused on this agenda because they
desire to prevent future hostilities that they believe will occur
unless this technology is developed
. The Corteum is assisting, but
despite their considerable intellects, they also are unable to develop
this technology.

What I'm about to tell you will seem impossible to
believe, but again, I'm only reporting what my notes say based on my
initial conversations with Dr. Anderson. He explained to me that there
are as many as 12 different extraterrestrial races currently involved
in the past, present, and future of earth and its destiny
. The ACIO,
because of its mission with the NSA, is the most knowledgeable group
about the various agendas of these 12 alien races.

Apparently there is an extraterrestrial race that may
have hostile intent and the technological potential to disrupt the
human social order and overtake it, as well as earth itself. This
concern is what motivated Fifteen to assign the Labyrinth Groupís
intellect and collective energy to create the ultimate defense weapon
-- which they refer to as Blank Slate Technology (BST) or a form of
time travel. I don't pretend to understand all of what Dr. Anderson
described regarding BST. My notes are a bit vague because he was
talking so far over my head I didn't even know what to write as notes.

When the Ancient Arrow project came under the control of
the ACIO, it was -- like all projects -- carefully scrutinized to
determine if there were any technology artifacts that could help in the
overall agenda of developing BST. When it was determined that the
Ancient Arrow project was in fact a time capsule from a future aspect
of humanity
, the Labyrinth Group seized the project from the ACIO and
essentially began a misinformation campaign back to the NSA
(note from Chris: this may very well be the defining moment of the new WingMakers website and misinformation "myth" agenda that would still include a diluted form of the mind-enhancing training).

Dr. Anderson was one of two scientists that held a level
12 clearance and was asked to lead in the translation of the
WingMakers' language and decode their various communication symbols. In
this process, he became aware of how to decode their language and began
to understand what they were trying to communicate. He became convinced
that the WingMakers were time travelers and possessed a form of BST. He
also became convinced that there were six additional time capsules
stored in various places around the globe, and that they held the
technologies or insights that would enable the development of BST

The reason he defected was that somehow in the process
of translating the WingMakers' language, he became a sympathizer of
their philosophy
. He felt that the WingMakers were communicating with
him and had selected him as their liaison. And when he acknowledged
this to his superiors, he was felt to be a risk to the project's
. Apparently, when personnel, regardless of clearance or rank
become known as security risks they are given a "memory therapy" that
essentially removes problematic experiences from their mind
. Dr.
Anderson felt certain that he was going to receive this "therapy"
imminently, and could not fathom the results of loosing his memories of
the WingMakers experience
. Thus, he defected from the ACIO and the
Labyrinth Group. The first to ever do so.

When he had contacted me, he had defected only the day
before. He told me that I would have to wait for him to contact me
again to set up a rendezvous time and place. Three days later he called
and we met that same afternoon. I wasn't prepared to believe him, but I
thought it was a provocative story and was worth spending an hour or
two investigating.

Anyway, what he proceeded to tell me in that first
meeting is largely contained in this journal entry. He showed me
photographs and documents from the Ancient Arrow project that appeared
authentic to my eyes
. He also showed me some of the technologies that
were in development by the ACIO concerning holographic fractal objects
or HFOs
as he called them. These were incredible to observe (and
equally impossible to explain)
and I must admit that my first
impression after seeing HFOs in action was that any organization that
could develop this technology was operating at a level well outside of
the mainstream
. It felt alien to me.

It was then I became at least a partial believer, and
called my employer and told them that I needed to take some personal
leave. I took one week off and spent most of it with Dr. Anderson
asking a thousand questions most of which, for the most part, he had
ready answers to
. Gradually I became a reluctant believer with a
healthy streak of skepticism. At the end of the week he asked me to
take some of his materials and publish them. He was operating at a
whole different level of experience. There were times that I honestly
felt he was an extraterrestrial, and even now I'm not certain that he
. (This from a person who 6 short months ago would have disputed
ETs and any other "bump-in-the-night" phenomenon.)

He was convinced that the ACIO would not allow him to
defect with his memory intact. He was fearful of their remote viewing
technology and was certain that they would try to track him down. He
wanted me to have possession of the materials only if I volunteered to
do so, and was willing to publish them. And through all of this, he
wasn't absolutely certain that the Labyrinth Group and their ET
friends, the Corteum, were intending anything bad. He just didn't want
his memory tampered with

I think he was mostly interested in exposing the
WingMakers' time capsule and its philosophy and communication symbols.
He never seemed that interested in exposing the ACIO and its secret
organization the Labyrinth Group. He told me about this entity only to
impress upon me that he was part of an organization that had unusual
powers and technologies, and to the extent they wanted to keep things
under wrap, they would use their considerable powers to do so
. And that
was why he had picked me at random to help him in getting this story
(note from Chris: you mean the "myth"? Sure seems like alot of specifics to establish a myth, but who knows - I still lean toward authentic).

Dr. Anderson was the most sincere individual I have ever
. Someone I would love to count among my friends. I was so impressed
with his manners, communication skills, and intellect
. At one time I
asked him what his IQ was, and with all humility intact, he simply
answered that there is no way to test it. And that the Labyrinth
Group's members are not interested in IQ so much as what he called
Fluid Intelligence, or the speed with which alternative, creative
solutions to a problem can be generated
(this also relates perfectly with the stated intent of the new WingMakers website via "James" as per the Q and A sessions - intriguing, to say the least).

He claimed this was the most important form of
intelligence, and without it, one would not be able to time travel. In
other words, he was convinced that time travel was not an independent
technology, but was integral to the traveler. The time traveler must
have a certain degree of fluid intelligence in order to withstand the
stress inherent in time travel, and the best way to handle the stress
was by having an extraordinarily fluid intelligence.

The thing I found so fascinating about Dr. Anderson was
his descriptions of how information about ETs, new physics, cosmology,
prophecies, and the galactic hierarchy were hidden from the public,
government, and even intelligence organizations
. He told me that only
one man had ever really tried to write about the NSA's Special Project
Laboratory and that was back in 1950, and according to my notes it was
written by Wilbur Smith, who I believe was a journalist from Canada.
Everything else that has been written is done so on the basis of pure

Dr. Anderson said that when this paper was circulated it
was the genesis to create the ACIO in order to build another layer of
what he called unacknowledged departments. He said that unacknowledged
departments are rare in intelligence agencies, but those that do exist
often telescope into greater levels of secrecy in order to remain
hidden from public and private scrutiny

He also inferred that there were corporate members of
the military-industrial complex that were involved in these
unacknowledged departments
. He claimed that the ACIO or its sister
organization, the Special Projects Laboratory, would sell diluted
technologies to private corporations and laboratories
, which in turn
would be commercialized for the military, and in some instances, even
consumer use

Dr. Anderson permitted me to tape-record two formal
interviews with him. These are probably the best way to understand his
perspective and the story that he has to tell. Even now as I'm writing
this letter, I find myself doubting much of what he told me, while at
the same time I can't imagine why he'd go to all this trouble if it
were just a game or charade of some kind
(note from Chris: Bingo! My rationale point exactly!!!). It just doesn't make any
sense in that context
. So I'm stuck somewhere in the middle of belief
and disbelief. I can only tell you that if only a small percentage of
his story is accurate, then citizens and their politicians need to wake
. According to Dr. Anderson, even our highest ranking government
officials and military intelligence officers lack access to the
information that he was privy to.

But if these unacknowledged secret departments exist and
private contractors working on behalf of the military are involved with
these secret organizations, some organization should be investigating
this. And they should have powers to grant witness protection,
immunity, and a variety of other inducements to get these secrets out
to the public or, at the very least, our government officials.

I have approximately 60 pages of notes from my initial
discussions with Dr. Anderson and then five transcripts from the five
interviews I conducted. I'd encourage anyone who's serious about
understanding these issues to read the interview transcripts. They're
probably our best records of what's going on behind closed doors
relative to the ET phenomenon, secret organizations, and time travel.


fredburks's picture

Thanks so much, Chris, for all your passion with this and for getting me to reread Sauthers' memo for the first time in several years. It's great! I just did a search and did not find the memo anywhere on the new website. I wonder why it was taken down  ;o)  I am fairly certain that the WingMakers website is not just a myth, though I could be wrong. I simply open to divine guidance and ask for what's best as I continue to explore these things. Please let us know if you hear back from either the WingMakers folks or Project Camelot. Thanks again, and you take care.

With abundant love and gratitude,

Berry's picture

Abrham/Hicks repeatedly says that we have an internal alarm system which will alert us to what is truth and what is not.  Our heart is the center of that alarm system and when something rings true, filled with veracity, love and light, we will know that it is truth from the Creator's own being.  If there is a moment of doubt, of conflict or discomfort, then we can know that this is not from our Infinite source of Being. 


When I first read the Wingmaker's original material that Fred had provided from their initial website, I thrilled and was taken into ecstacy with this information/essay.  If indeed, this had been a fraud from the very first, my question is: Would Spirit have excited my spirit to such a degree as to be close to touching/penetrating the veil of forgetfullness and rejoicing in the revelation of such Truth?  I think not.  Let the heart reveal the integrity of these various revelations.  The essence of this experience is discernment of the Heart.  Let your Spirit/internal guidance confirm what is true for you as a Unique Expression of the One.

Love and Light,



--- Post removed at author's request ---

ChrisBowers's picture

Thank you Fred, Berry and FFG for chiming in with perfect resonating logic from the heart.  I could not agree more.  There are simply too many sincere and intelligent searching souls that have had the same experience with the original WingMakers/Ancient Arrow story to simply dismiss all of this as universal truths brilliantly framed in a staged myth (although I totally agree with you FFG that that has been done before in tall tale storytelling like in the bible in places by leaders who used inspired storytelling to inspire their people to keep them moving forward).  For me, it boils down to this simple and inescapable fact - neither Anne, J. Sauthers, or Dr. Anderson said anything about a myth while explaining in great detail what went down with the Ancient Arrow discovery and all state-sanctioned activities that followed in its wake.

I am inclined to dismiss the case for "myth" and allow myself to be reminded of the very thing that J. Sauthers explicitly mentioned about the Standard Operating Procedure protocol involving misinformation that he was briefing his team on concerning his very possible use of in the very near future from the date of that memo.  I am inclined (according to all info I have been pouring over) to also dismiss "James/Mahu Nahi" with an asterisk.  He/she has brilliantly mixed truth and lies on the new website, so we would still recognize many things that would accurately resonate with us, but discernment is definitely in order when it comes to studying that website.

I go on the record as believing with all my heart that we are being assisted from time to time, and that assistance is matter of fact Standard Operating Procedure for the lion's share of advanced civilizations, the vast majority being wise and benevolent, and that the ones who are not as wise and benevolent are little more than just rude and nosey and need to get a life, LOL!  There is much evidence for this stated position and I wholeheartedly anticipate more in the near future with the way things are going, again, with an asterisk!  One of the possibilities for an upcoming (if they do it) false flag event is to claim that ET's are coming, invading, attacking (not sure how they would frame it), but the four in the pipeline may be that one, an asteroid problem, an attack on a chemical plant, an attack on a oil refinery, or remotely even the possible detonation of the nuke that came up missing a while back when six live nukes were illegally flown from base to base over the continental US, a huge no no.  Six were airlifted and five were ultimately accounted for at their new location (If anyone knows anything about that missing nuke that I am not accounting for here, please let us know).

Got a bit off subject, but you get the point about false flag events and the possible mythological use of ET's.  In my own personal research concerning advanced civilizations, the thing that resonates with me the most is their (the wise, benevolent ones anyway) utter reluctance to interfere or show themselves because they know it is possible to make mistakes and to do more harm than good.  In my mind, this places them in the best stewardship frame of mind to intervene at the appropriate times and be very conservative and careful about intervention.  Another thing that really resonated with me is that sense of joy from realizing that "they" really do care about us and our progress!  That is such a beautiful thing!  The other thing that resonated with me is that it is the rude, nosey and obnoxious ET's that sometimes are seen and/or toy with individual humans like it were some kind of fun game, but I do not believe we are ever going to be in danger of an mass ET invasion of planet earth.  On the contrary, I believe there are advanced ones trying to save us from our biggest enemy - ourselves at this stage in our evolution....

Love, Chris

Berry's picture


You said above:

"One of the possibilities for an upcoming (if they do it) false flag event is to claim that ET's are coming, invading, attacking (not sure how they would frame it), but the four in the pipeline may be that one, an asteroid problem, an attack on a chemical plant, an attack on a oil refinery, or remotely even the possible detonation of the nuke that came up missing a while back when six live nukes were illegally flown from base to base over the continental US, a huge no no.  Six were airlifted and five were ultimately accounted for at their new location (If anyone knows anything about that missing nuke that I am not accounting for here, please let us know)."

The chances of a false flag event before the end of the year are quite possible. However, with regard to nukes, I have read multiple time from multiple channeling ET entities, that they are actively preventing any kind of nuclear actions and have already several times, deactivated nuclear bombs, thus keeping the world from going into a Maldek state, ie becoming a belt of astoroids.  Their prime directive is non-interference but they also will not allow the Earth to be destroyed.  I will try to find some of those transmissions where they have said that nuclear explosions are not to be tolerated, in spite of the 1st distortion of the Law of One, which is Free Will.

In the Love/Light of the One.


ChrisBowers's picture

I have also seen evidence of their intervening to prevent the detonation of a nuke!!!

Thank you for posting that!!!!  Looking forward to any more you can find on that...

Love, Chris

--- Post removed at author's request ---

Berry's picture

I know that I have read numerous times where the Confederation and other Higher density/extraterrestrial entities have and will continue to prevent nuclear detonation on earth. Search as I could, I actually only found on reference to provide. It is a Matthew transmission and sums it up nicely.


I know that in the book, Only Planet of Choice, the Council of Nine made it clear that no nuclear weapons would be allowed to be detonated. Kryon has also intimated as much.  As I come across these items I will add to this list.



--- Post removed at author's request ---

UrsulaD's picture

Thanks Chris for posting the material here for us. I have now copied and pasted it and will read it again at leisure. All I can add is that when I originally read the material, I was filled with awe, excitement and love, to know that we have been left clues regarding what has happened in the future and are being watched over with benevolence by our future selves (sic?). The material resonated very strongly with me and I agree with Chris and Berry, that the 'myth' story is the disinformation material.

I grew up reading Science Fiction before I even entered my teens. Had friends who were 'addicted' to SF and who between them have a few thousand books, most of which I have read. I like to believe that I have a very strong, built-in BS meter and that the Wingmakers material would not have resonated so strongly if it had been a myth. I will believe that the original material is the truth, unless it is totally, incontrovertably proven to be made up. I don't think anybody will be able to do that.

I have also read the assurances that it will not be allowed for mankind to detonate any nuclear bombs and that there have been cases where nuclear missiles have been destroyed by our ET friends. I believe this to be true too.

The journey mankind has had on this beautiful planet Earth has been a first of its kind experiment which I believe is about to draw to its successful conclusion.

As we have the power of co-creation, whatever we believe is true . . . .

Love U

ChrisBowers's picture

Sorry about the typo (ACIM) in my 2nd post above.

It is, as you already know

ACIO (Advanced Contact Intelligence Organization)

Love, Chris

P.S. Concerning the myth claim, consider these last words of "Anne" (not her real name - maybe not even female) from the introduction on the original WingMakers website:

“Believe me, I know that this whole story may seem impossible, but I can only tell you that I’ve seen detailed drawings and photographs of the artifacts taken from the Ancient Arrow site, and these are most assuredly, to my eyes, not of this time or world. They’re unlike anything I’ve ever seen. Either the WingMakers are real, or someone has gone to a lot of trouble to convince me otherwise and again, I’m a simple journalist without any ax to grind relative to secret government operations, ETs, time travel, or alien artifacts.

I’m not here to convert anyone. There is nothing to convert to. I simply want to disclose this material and let each individual absorb it as they choose. I will add additional documents and artifacts from the Ancient Arrow site when I feel it is safe to do so, but for now, there’s enough material on this site to introduce anyone to the culture of the WingMakers.

I hope you take the time to immerse yourself in these materials. If you do, you may be surprised at the result.”

Anne (not my real name)

Written October 23, 1998

So there it is - I have made my case and believe, along with "Anne", that it makes no sense for someone to go to this much trouble to secretly set up a "myth" and then tell readers later that it IS a myth! I also state for the record the compelling evidence and logic found within the pages of the book I mentioned, "The People of the Secret" by Ernest Scott....

P.S. Notice the mention of "James" (aka Mahu Nahi) in the "bad" list in the "Good, Bad and Ugly of UFO-ology" attachment below.

ChrisBowers's picture

Here is an email I just sent to Mark Hempel (or James if he/she is so inclined to answer), webmaster of the new WingMakers website. I will post the answer if I get one....

Hello Mark,

I wrote you a while ago to ask you and James some questions and you were so very kind to take the time to answer them.  I was wondering if you (or James if you could submit this last question of mine to him) would be so kind as to try to answer just one more lingering question, the “pink elephant left standing in the room” when the dust settled in my mind, concerning “when” I was told that the whole WingMakers/Ancient Arrow story was/is technically just a very inspirational “myth”.  Let me preface the question by asking whether or not the WingMakers story is explicitly described as a “myth” anywhere in an introduction (or somewhere else) on the current WingMakers website (can’t remember if I saw something like that or not on your website)?

My lingering question is this:
In light of how meticulously and exhaustively detailed was the framing and introduction of the WingMakers/Ancient Arrow/ACIO/Labyrinth Group story in so seemingly apparent “lead-one-to-believe” authenticity located on the original WingMakers website, as well as a few other websites strongly alluding to the authenticity of the WingMakers story, why in the world weren’t the readers told right up front that the whole Ancient Arrow project story is just a very inspirational and brilliantly-written science fiction “myth” designed to inspire and lead a reader toward fluid intelligence (among other wonderful things)?  When one reads (as I did again the other day) “Anne’s” account of and interviews with “Dr. Anderson” on the old website, or read J. Sauthers’ memo to the “Labyrinth group”, one is most definitely led to strongly suspect they are being meticulously  introduced to a very real and credible account of something very very profound, the very real possibility that mankind has been receiving assistance for thousands of years and that that kind of “advanced civilization protocol” is most likely altogether commonplace within evolutionary life forms throughout the universe/multiverse - a faithful and generous big brother holding little brother’s hand and guiding him through the woods so to speak.  I have also been reading “The People of the Secret” by Ernest Scott which aptly details the very real possibility that this is exactly how things work for a very long time now.

Waiting to tell people much later that the whole WingMakers story is really just a myth runs a very high risk of betraying the reader and losing his or her confidence, and this seems to fall anywhere from “gotcha!” mean-spirited to very short-sided (to the point of self-defeating?) and down right foolish (from a purely and simply logical perspective).  It just does not make any apparent sense when one simply considers a little common sense and the rule of “occam’s razor” (the simplest explanation is usually the correct one), plus it runs very contrary to implied intent of the story (unless the story is actually true and “the myth” is the myth).  Mark (or James), I am begging you as a brother and fellow citizen of this Law of One working with you, please try to help me understand this very apparent failure of simple logic and utter lack of consideration in this illogical decision to not tell people right up front at the beginning of the story that they are reading science fiction!  As you well know, there are millions of readers and lovers of science fiction who would have faithfully and happily followed this brilliantly-written WingMakers story anyway, chapter after chapter to its author’s conclusion, so why would anyone (advanced or otherwise) run the risk of offending so many and possibly running them off if the whole apparently-benevolent-core-intent was to attract searching souls to a knowledge (whether framed in a “myth” or not) that can assist them in learning to develop “fluid intelligence” and use so much more of their 4D brain capacity as they prepare for Ascension into 4D life, or just prepare for really knowing/understanding that 3D physical life does not really matter as much as they previously thought it did while they are going through difficult times on this planet (possibly) in the very near future???  Please help me to understand this apparent failure of simple logic and common sense if you would please...

In Love, Light and Hope for an answer,
Chris Bowers
Transformation Team Portal at

ChrisBowers's picture

Berry, as I was reading that Matthew link, all I could think about is all of the depleted uranium rounds that have been used since the balkans and is still being used today by our own military. In some ways (radioactively speaking) it is actually worse because it is less dramatic and dynamic an event, but just as dangerous to plant and animal DNA, creating a very fine dust that resuspends with every sunrise and passes the brain, lung and fetus barrier. One need only look at the babies being born in Iraq right now (and some locations in the Balkans) to understand the ongoing horrors of depleted uranium munitions. I look forward to a time when all this insanity is dismissed for better ideas about how to live together on a planet.

Love, Chris

ChrisBowers's picture

You know, another thing just occurred to me concerning the very secretive "James" or "Mahu Nahi".
Sometimes people say something without knowing they said it (happens alot in politics lately). Bill Ryan's email to me bothered me initially when he so nonchalantly mentioned that the WingMakers story "is a myth, technically speaking" and that his partner at Project Camelot (Kerry) has the movie rights to "the WingMakers material". Something about his tone was so matter of fact (was it a slip up?). But as I read again today Bill's mention of

"she (Kerry) has the movie rights to the WingMakers material and knows Mark and James",

something doesn't jive with James' very strong claim of a need for secrecy (who needs secrecy to perpetuate a myth???). It would appear that Kerry knows him/her/whoever quite well and owns the "movie rights" to "the WingMakers material"!

It has been strongly considered that the original WingMakers website has been "jacked" by individuals wishing to exploit the "material" for commercial gain (among other obvious reasons already covered in great detail). I am one of those who believes this to be true because there was absolutely nothing for sale on the original website which so perfectly displayed a pure intention to just share info about the WingMakers/Ancient Arrow story (not "material") and the new website is obviously more of a commercial venture. I will ask it again, why does "James" require secrecy to perpetuate an elaborate myth???????

One more question to consider: Why does Kerry from Project Camelot know James personally and have the "movie rights to the WingMakers material"??? I have not yet heard back from Mark, James, Bill, or Kerry (and I don't plan on holding my breath).


ChrisBowers's picture

I was discussing all of this with Kerry (my Kerry! Delusion duly noted) last night and she brought up an interesting rationale. Bill said in his email to me, "Its a myth - technically speaking". What if there was no more info coming onto the old website and somebody like Bill and/or Kerry from Project Camelot looked into the registration of the domain name, got the rights to it, and the WingMakers Ancient Arrow story is now "technically" a myth, only because there is apparently no longer anyone like Anne or Dr. Anderson (for whatever reason) willing or able to come forward to verify the original story or post additional info as was the original plan according to "Anne"?

This may very well be the story behind the story, that it has been "labeled" a myth only because the original information leaks have been sufficiently plugged and no one else is talking, so we now have certain individuals (like "James") attempting to carry on with the inherent truths embedded in the WingMakers story, making it "technically" a myth, only because it cannot be adequately and "professionally" verified. I just do not think Bill's use of the word "technically" was flippant. If that is true then the use of the word is very telling when one really thinks about why someone would use it to describe the conditions of the myth.

Science fiction writing is never "technically" science fiction unless it is based, loosely or otherwise, on a true story.....

This might also explain why "James" feels the ongoing need to remain very secretive, and would also explain why the original MP3 files of chamber music are no longer accessible...

I am pretty sure I have covered just about every consideration I can think of, but who knows - just using this forum to catalog all of these questions and things that make one go hmmmm.....

Bob07's picture

Thanks all so much for the very engaging discussion above.  I'm a new member of TT, and I may be coming in after the energy for disussing the topic has dissipated, but I'll post this anyhow.

As with several of you, the original WM material resonated with me; I knew that it containted some pretty profound truth that I'm 100% comfortable with.  In fact, it had quite a profound impact on me.  But  (leaving aside the new WM website altogether) a few things in the "original" material bother me -- including the nature of ACIO (did I remember the acronym correctly?),with its elite mindset and its commitment to using disinformation and misinformation whenever they deem it necessary.  In other words, can we trust them?

First, I'm uneasy about any secret organization being in control of such an important body of information and a project to develop time travel.  Who wouldn't be, given the history of elite secret organizations on our planet, where they have brought us, and their plans to consummate complete control of our planetary civilization and form a one-world government (David Rockefeller's avowed dream)?  (I know there have been benevolent secret societies in history, but let's consider the worst case here.)  The WM material talks about this one-world society and government as a positive thing -- and I can see that if we're going to interact positively and co-operatively with other galactic (and beyond) civilizatons, we probably will have to function somewhat as a unified global civilization (although this may not be necessary -- who knows?).  So, since we're moving toward a one-world economy and government now, on a most destructive and nasty trajectory under the control of the elite financial and corporate cabal, it seems natural to feel uneasy (to say the least) about what the WM material says about one-world government being necessary and inevitable. If we, the people of the Earth, are in control of this government, then all is well.  But if it continues to develop as a financial and corporate oligarchy with the people essentially being serfs, then all is definitely not well.  (Unless something like this occurs: The elite forms a one-world government (an oligarchy), but they can't hold power, and the people take control of the governmental structure -- just as the Rome at first suppressed Christianity but was eventually taken over by it.  Just a thought.)

Second, I seem to remember that the material predicts that we'll have a global digital economy by 2008, with the admonition that we shouldn't be afraid of this.  I confess that I am leery of this.  I'd like to look at it more closely for a minute.  Now, most of us who have looked into the economy and understand the fiat currencies that underlie it (some of the TT course material deals with this), know that there's nothing behind our money at all but debt and the vague assurances of governments.  Our dollars and pounds and whatever are just paper.  They are created out of nothing and become our debt to the central banks who create them.  How much more would digital money be created out of nothing -- at will -- and it could be disappeared at will from any personal, business, or government account by computer.  (There is already the "Promis" software that can digitally remove money from accounts online without a trace.  Is this where the government's (our) missing $3.1 trillion went to?)  If all currency becomes digital, how much more insecure and available to manipulation from the greedy and powerful could it be?  Also, although 2008 is not over yet, it seems unlikely that this prediction could come true on time.  Now, if folks from the future have written this, then they would know exactly what would happen when.  In sum, what I end up with here is the question of whether this digital global currency thing really was part of the original material, or was the site possibly hijacked a little earlier than we think -- that is, before Fred Burks preserved it -- so that some corrupted elements were slipped in.  I don't say this has happened; I haven't come to a conclusion about it.  I'm only wondering, because assurances that a digital currency (and a one-world government) would be beneficial and not a cause of concern at this point in our collective experience sound and feel a bit questionable.

Take care,


davelambert's picture

Hi Bob et al,

I also find the WM material fascinating and just a wee bit
frightening as well. Like most everyone
else here, though, the deeper truths presented resound more thoroughly with me
than anything I’ve come across. To me, it feels like just the kind of reality check that we need. I’m a
student of words, and the way the WM writings use them amazes me. While it takes some intelligence and
diligence to work through the essays, it’s hard to name any treatise that’s
more concise and more logical while being radically different from our
traditional paradigms. Terms like
sovereign integral and prime creator are almost alien in their objectivity, and
yet convey deep meaning. The last time I
remember being struck by such a singular motif in human thought was in an essay
by Galileo, where he used the term “the level of unity” to describe the integer

Likewise, the paintings spoke to me on many levels. I wrote a long comment about them back in
February, which you can read at if you’re interested. Their signature
motif is the Sacred Feminine; and as we draw nearer to the Galactic Equator and
deeper into the Aquarian paradigm we’re rediscovering this essential divine principle
which has been sequestered for the last couple of millennia.

I believe that as we undergo a sort of quickening throughout
the world – synchronous with the rediscovery of the Divine Feminine – we will
learn to integrate these halves of All That Is within our own sovereign
integrity. This, more than anything,
will liberate us from old paradigms and transform society. Rednecks may joke about cities of
metrosexuals and feminazis, but those are just caricatures. The reality will be men and women who are
free to live up to their potential in every way. Part of the Wingmaker’s message is an
invitation to live free of our stereotypes and dogmas.

First, I'm uneasy
about any secret organization being in control of such an important body of
information and a project to develop time travel. Who wouldn't be, given
the history of elite secret organizations on our planet…

Now that you mention it, that’s something to be concerned
about. I’ll put it on my list. I’ve been pretty focused on the individual applications
of the philosophy revealed in the WM materials. seems natural to
feel uneasy (to say the least) about what the WW material says about one-world
government being necessary and inevitable.

It does, doesn’t it. As you pointed out, we’re hurtling in that direction now without having
been consulted in the least, and in fact the PTB haven’t spoken publicly yet
about their intentions even though their actions make them obvious. Perhaps they never will. All they really have to do is keep everyone
either too afraid or too preoccupied to stand up, think, and speak their hearts
for a little longer, and it will be a fait
. There will be only
overseers, slaves, and outlaws, who will call themselves Free.

But consider that the inexorable tide of history has led in
the direction of world federation. I
don’t believe we can ever return to the level of clan organization. Something happened in the progression from
village to city. Bureaucrats came into
being, and strong, charismatic wise women and men were replaced by men (mostly)
of ambition. Since then, cities have
become federations, which have become nation-states. Likewise, kingdoms have become empires. All of the above have risen and fallen with
regularity, but the trend has consistently been toward bigger problems and
bigger organizations to implement and manage solutions – which have
nevertheless been decided upon by an elite with near universality. So it seems to me that the trend toward world
confederation or government is well-nigh unstoppable if all systems remain

I think there are still some wild cards in the deck. If the Wingmakers are the new-and-improved us, there are implications regarding our
understanding of the nature of time. For those who have considered time-travel a technological challenge, it may in reality be more of a mental or
even a spiritual one. When zero-point
energy becomes reality, I have a feeling it will be dead-simple. Also, I think there is a way – not yet
discovered – to neutralize radioactivity and much pollution. Should the WM paradigm of time prove to be
closer to truth than our own, we might discover we’re being helped and
encouraged by our own future selves, and we might spend some time encouraging
our past selves or ego-states, as well. We might discover that we enter into a material body as many times as we
like – or because we must. We might
discover that we are our ancestors –
all of them.

As for digital money, debt-based currency makes worldwide
trade ultimately unworkable. Some new
way will have to be found to transmit value. At the local level, there is already a surge in barter. As a soapmaker and furniture repairman, I
find many opportunities to exchange for small items and services. As a writer and speaker, barter makes me
twice as negotiable. Entrepreneurial
types will have to adapt to these new paradigms. The more the big systems fail, the stronger
the guerilla economy will become.

I think the WM material offers both hope and
illumination. I simply don’t believe our
problems are insoluble.

(The elite forms a
one-world government (an oligarchy), but they can't hold power, and the people
take control of the governmental structure -- just as the Rome at first
suppressed Christianity but was eventually taken over by it. Just a

I don’t think Christianity overcame Rome. I think the PTB of the day cleverly crafted a synthetic religion using
elements of both paganism and Christianity, and used it as a method of
control. It was a brilliant move – so
brilliant that most folks still don’t realize that religion the way Jeshua taught it died out nearly
two thousand years ago.


davelambert's picture

After reading all of the above, I was moved to go back and review the WM site again, especially the wonderful paintings.  It suddenly struck me that some of the images resonated on some of the same wavelengths as the major arcana of the Tarot.  Granted, there are 23 paintings and only 22 trumps (numbered 0 through 21), so I didn't expect a real correlation.  But just to satisfy my curiosity, I compared the cards to the paintings both by arranging them in sequence with the numbered trumps corresponding to the numbers of the chambers, and also by intuition, that is, arranging them according to how I "felt" they resonated, regardless of their numeric designation.  The results are intriguing.

As far as symbolic or iconographic correlation, I felt there was a clear resonance between #2 The Empress with its corresponding painting, and similar connections with #8 Strength, #9 The Hermit, #12 The Hanged Man, and #16 The Tower, #20 judgment, with #0 The Fool fitting rather well with Chamber 23.  There were a number of others where I feel there may be a harmonic resonance, but I couldn't fit the imagery.  And there are some which don't correspond in any obvious way at all.



Bob07's picture

Hi 8-d (or do you prefer "dave"?):

I appreciate your well-considered comments.  I also looked at your comments regarding the WM artwork.  Very nice.  But I think my "in" will be what yours was: that is, to just sit with the paintings and let them work.  They may not even work on a conscious level, as someone has said.  But the point that you made about the Divine Feminine rings true.  My wife and I just returned from a visit to Wiltshire Country, England, where most of the crop circles appear.  We visited a number of these formations, saw them from the air, and heard a few lectures on them.  These things abound with sacred geometry, and the divine feminine is richly represented in them.  She will apparently figure big in our future (thank God).  (If you don't know much about crop circles, I recommend visiting two websites: and The first one has photos of formations from 12 or 14 years (not all of them come up) and the second is used by people on the ground who want to visit the formations as they appear.  On this one there's an interesting geometrical-mathematical analysis of one formation that was laid down in June of this year (click on "The 2008 Season", then click on the "Barbury Castle" thumbnal photo; then scroll down the page to the geometrical overlay on the photo of the formation.  Several people came to the same conclusion independently -- that the formation represents "pi", complete with decimal point and ellipses at the end.  This one does not touch on the divine feminine -- at least not obviously).

Back to WM.  The questions and concerns I voiced about a couple of things in the WM material don't kill the material for me or make me think that we'll end up with a permanent "1984" global dictatorship.  But they do just sit there as questions -- unanswerable by thinking and supposing, answerable only by the unfolding of events.  In the meantime, I do trust that something very big, profound, and positive for our and our planet's evolution is afoot.  And too, I realize that one's (my in this case) perspective is variable as I "zoom in" or "zoom out" on out world situation.  When I zoom in, I see the elements, the duality, the whole struggle with its fear and uncertainty.  When I zoom out, I see that we're all -- including the financial elite, warmongers, criminals -- Us.  This is our collective drama to move forward, and, as one of the saints (Saint Teresa?) said, "Everything is exactly as it should be."  Talk about riding two horses; I guess that's what we have to learn to do.  However, even with this big perspective, no particular outcome is guaranteed.  We could end up with an enlightened world, no world at all, or anything in between.  As you said, there are wildcards -- probably a number of them, unimaginable to us as we sit here thinking and wondering:  ET's, Rainbow Warriors, Shambhala Warriors, a Compassion Bomb -- who the hell knows?  I actually take comfort in the fact that there's far more going on here than my little brain and imagination can understand, much less talk about coherently.

Actually I agree with what you said about the nature and history of Christianity.  I just forgot.  But my point was that revolutions can happen from within a structure.  So, if the neo-oligarchs do succeed in creating a one-world rule, it may become metamorphosed by the blossoming of our own self-rule.  If there's one thing I'll say that I know, it's that our collective evolution is in part about freedom -- on all levels.  That "seed" can't be killed, always is trying to sprout and find expression -- in all conscious beings.  It's our highway home.  So, any efforts to suppress this growth must meet with failure eventually.  Even those who do the suppressing are working against their own innermost needs and destiny; so they will fail.  Will they fail before life on the planet does?  I believe so, but, again, no guarantees.

I resonated with what you said about our possibly being our own ancestors -- all of them.  If so, there is perfect justice -- and perfect learning.  Even if one doesn't accept reincarnation, if we are all expressions of the one Consciousness, then we're all one other anyhow -- present, past, and future.  Ah, what a trip.  What an opportunity.  No place to hide (so, who wants to hide?)  Anyhow, boredom is impossible.

As far as the Tarot goes, I know nothing about it.  Hopefully someone else does.

Take care,


ChrisBowers's picture

Welcome to da TT cosmic sandbox and so glad you ignited the WM discussion again. I have been a big fan of this material since coming across it in the TT lessons, but I must say, with all of the questions that remain from the way the info has been treated over the years, I tend to agree with all you mentioned in your initial post above. In fact, I will take it one step further now - I now believe the WM story, whether true or not, is moot! There is now so much more info coming forward that is so much more forthright and sincere that I no longer care whether or not the story is true due to so many more like it having to do with basically the same thing, entities from somewhere other than this planet.

One of my more disappointing moments was when I could not retrieve the original chamber music samples from the original WingMakers website. Someone removed them, but left the page there that makes it look like you are going to be able to copy, or at least be able to listen to, the samples developed from the alleged optical disc from chamber 23.

The last straw for me was when I contacted Bill and Kerry at Project Camelot and Bill told me that Kerry owns the movie rights to the WingMaker material. Good news is that there is so much more info that all but trumps the WingMakers material - at the very least leaves the WM story in the shadow of much more informative and expansive data told by Ra in the Law of One books (106 sessions). What I do still treasure and take away from the WingMakers material is the beautiful green ray intuitive heart chakra info that one can run with and benefit from no matter where it comes from.

You will notice two forums we began recently on the Law of One - an Introduction forum and a forum started in Groups (can be seen in the lists on the left of home page) of book one. There is so much pertinent info relating to what is really going on on so many other levels and other planets and other solar systems, other galaxies and other universes, that it pretty much makes the question of whether the WingMakers story is true or not a moot point that should really no longer concern or stump any of us. We can already know just about all we need to know without the WingMakers story.  Let them have their movie rights and who know, maybe they will make a brilliant adaptation of the material into a very cool movie someday, but that is surely no longer important, if it ever was in the first place.

Let "them" (whoever them is - and who cares at this point of their apparent ongoing insincere misinfo campaign) play their silly little games with the heads/hearts of those who would choose to cling to this one story among so many other more sincere and credible accounts on the same/similar subject. It just plain no longer matters at this point - Come join us on the Law of One forum in book one and read the sessions in book 1&2 and see if you dont agree! The WingMakers story, as amazing as the original story is/was, is reduced to a quaint anecdotal sideshow that carries little to no fundamental importance in comparison to the info in the Law of One sessions. I dont know what took me so long to finally look into the Ra Law of One sessions, but I am sure glad I finally did! It has cleared up many things for me.

Hope to see you over there, and again, welcome to the TT,


--- Post removed at author's request ---

rovin's picture

Hi all thanks for the discussion.  I am grateful. The nature of this discussion has made me look again at the WM site. Whilst initially impressed and willing to go along with the material (because I feel there is much wisdom there and I want to believe!) I find myself now rapidly drawing away. I feel a strong shift of emphasis in my own thinking( and feeling) on the matter toward the emaphsis Chris and Elizabeth have been talking about. Specifically, If I am truthful with myself, I find the music on the WM site most insipid. The thought that enlightened beings from the future would leave us this music as inspiration? Meditation music? is somewhat difficult to digest. (I'm trying not to be judgemental but alas...)  I know on other posts I have reacted strongly when music is mentioned (David Wilcock for example) because there is (as in the WM material) such a strong emphasis on a very Western techno-pop aspect. I'm not suggesting that techno-pop isn't a rich source of expression but I would listen to SanFrancisco artist Karsh Kale as a better example of this type of music that reaches a deeper level of human expression. Specifically I would suggest that in the WM music files there is a lack of human expression in the music, too much sugar. If the intention is to entrain for mediation purposes then I would recommend the music of Pakisatini singer Abida Parveen or Indian singer Sheila Chandra who are able to lead people into astounding meditative trances for periods of up to five hours (in Abida's case). The music of the world is so rich and vibrant once outside the western tradition (and to some extent inside the Western tradition) that I would rather be here experiencing the master musicians of the now rather then music from WM.  I don't want to sound negative, their is a wisdom on this site.  However, I cannot believe the music on WM comes from enlightened beings. As one, Rob

ChrisBowers's picture

I agree Rob. The music on the new WM website by the group Soul Food, I believe, seems to be more of a sugary watered down commercial venture version of whatever may have been on that optical disk, assuming the disk even exists. Since I no longer really care whether it does or not, but was/am still very interested in finding some honest research in the field of frequency, I found exactly what I was looking for by the man who made the focus of his Phd be about the study of frequency and the history of ancient sounds, chants, and the Solfeggio tones (some call it god's perfect circle of sound), Jonathan Goldman.

I will forever, like Elizabeth alluded to in her post, treasure those things from the WM material that so touched my heart, for they are resonating truth no matter what the particular source du jour, but I would guide sincere seekers to the Ra sessions Law of One material long before I would even consider sending them to the sticky emotional confusion of the WingMakers/Ancient Arrow story that even Bill and Kerry at Project Camelot call "technically" a myth (always wondered what Bill meant by "technically"), for that would run the risk of them ending up at the same dead end that we all ended up at, wanting more, denied, frustrated, and finding they need to just move on.

The WM story was never as important as we made it out to be - no single story is!

davelambert's picture

Rob, your comments are very interesting. I haven't listened to the music on the site, but I too have reservations about the WM material. While there is a great deal of depth and wisdom in the WM material, I can't give up the suspicion that this is just a psy-op. My reasoning is based in the awareness that the PTB have always worked both sides of the aisle, so to speak. As you know I have found the artwork at the site to be exciting and profound, but I also expressed doubts that this was ancient art. I know too much about pigment chemistry and permanence to simply take anyone's word for it that a piece of art that looks like it was done with modern oil pastels is actually ancient. It's possible, and the material forces me to keep an open mind. But part of keeping an open mind is recognition that this material could simply be a diversion, created by people who want us to fail in our quickening.

This applies, in my mind, to all of what's going on. I don't know if ETs are real or not: I've seen an photographed UFOs, and I have had some very odd experiences that may or may not have involved offplanet "beings." I very much want to believe that some enlightened beings are watching over us and will assist us. But I can't deny that if they exist, they could just as easily wish to eat us - as is supposedly the case with the reptilians. And even if they do exist and show themselves, professing friendship and benevolence, our own government provides abundant evidence that you can't believe what people say. What is true of our own leaders could just as well be true of the aliens: if their lips are moving (assuming they have lips), they are lying.

What I trust is what I feel deep in my spirit. I believe in the quickening, or ascension as most people call it. I believe that our present system is in the process of falling apart utterly, and that it's possible and even likely that a kind of golden age will follow. Or depends on us.

Back to ET music...have you heard the Gliese 581c signal? This apparently really did come from outer space roughly one year ago, and while it isn't music in the strict sense, it is certainly melodious and beautiful. I wish I could somehow attach the file so you could listen to it, but it's a midi file which this site doesn't accept.  Here's the site where you can download signals from Gliese 581c.

I don't know if there's chicanery involved in the creation of these sounds or not...but it certainly sounds otherworldly.


rovin's picture

Dear Dave and Chris, probably not for this post but through your posts you reveal things abouts yourselves which are really fascinating like your knowledge of pigment chemistry or Chris' architectural and structural knowledge.I'd like to sit down with you two guys and get to know you better, hang out.  I have heard the music you speak of and really enjoy it.  I imagine the music of 'advanced' souls to be more like the crop circles, that is, to be more based in mathematics, phi ratios, sacred geomentry, fractals and most particularly Pythagorean tuning systems.

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davelambert's picture


I appreciate the compliment - but almost everyone here is more interesting and more accomplished than I am.  I'm just a stranger in a strange land.


ChrisBowers's picture

I too thank you for your kind words Rob, and have felt the same about you many times concerning your knowledge of frequency/sound, and just your steady and calm way that is always a pleasure to witness and be a part of.  How fun it would be if a bunch of us could just "thought process" ourselves to Australia, get partially shitfaced of course, but not enough to dull the conversation!!!!  Since I truly believe there are already other higher density entities traveling at the speed of thought as we speak (how else would they get here over alleged huge spans of space/time unless they had some other knowledge working relationship with infinite intelligence and time/space???), I will very "obtusely"  and non chalantly claim, in typical apparently clueless and cavalier fashion, that it is just a matter of "time" before we do the same, giving no more thought to it than we do now about breathing (although we really should concentrate on our breathing more than we do!!!).

And Dave, me dear and so very capable brother, as usual you doth sell yourself so short, but don't worry, we all know better by what we have witnessed, seen and heard from you and your extremely erudite gifts/talents.....LOL

Love/Light, Light/Love, Chris

davelambert's picture

And Dave, me dear and so very capable brother, as usual you doth sell yourself so short...

Thanks for reminding me that I must never acknowledge my poverty and powerlessness without also claiming the gifts and powers I was bequeathed.  Never do one without the other.


ChrisBowers's picture

I am placing this particular interview here because I sort of left the whole Ancient Arrow WingMakers story in a disgusted huff, but this interview is just one more clue that the dam of suppressed info is about to break in a way that the NWO types will not be able to contain.

After listening to this interview and considering all of the other similar stories you have heard that affirm what Bill, Kerry and David are discussing, you may find like I did that the WingMakers story fits very well within the framework of the amazing and revealing discussion.  I have come to intuitively trust David's erudite blend of intuition and logic, and this just makes the WingMakers story ring so true that it intuitively feels like just one more simple matter of fact.

To some degree we will become more and more aware of, imperical evidence is highly overrated and can be very controlling and limiting - Listen and see what you think..... YouTube - JUMPROOM TO MARS : a new conversation with David Wilcock

Love/Light, Chris

P.S.  for a better understanding of what David, Bill and Kerry are alluding to concerning the Montauk Project listen to these two links and then study more about Al Bialek if you wish and also Henry Deacon.  Al Bialek is either stone cold insane or he is what he said he is, one of the two who fell off the ship that was used in the Philadelphia Experiment time travel experiment and ended up 40 years in the future, much like the Hollywood movie dramatized (minus the romantic angle, LOL)

YouTube - Nikola Tesla: The Philadephia Experiment, Time Travel Secret

YouTube - Al Bielek - The Philadelphia Experiment Montauk Project

and here is Al's website for more info

The Philadelphia Experiment and Montauk Survivor Accounts

and a few more people of interest would be Richard Hoagland and Dan Burisch

Dan Burisch

Project Camelot | Dan Burisch

Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch uncensored

Project Camelot | Richard Hoagland

The Enterprise Mission

Dailymotion - Richard Hoagland P1 Mars Cydonia, a video from pincerpal. richard, hoagland, moon, mars, evolve

Project Camelot interviews Richard Hoagland - Part 1 of 3

fredburks's picture

Thank for that great info, Chris. I love Wilcock! Though I believe Bielek truly believes all of his memories, I suspect he has had memories programmed into him to throw people off track. Wild times we live in. I highly recommend opening to your spiritual guidance as you explore these powerful materials. Thanks for joining us in the exciting journey! With much love and joy, Fred

davelambert's picture

I spent quite a bit of time at Avalon. Bill & Kerry have no credibility at all as far as I am concerned. They are simply con artists who have scammed folks into supporting their globe-trotting. They are entrepreneurs, nothing more.

...she has the movie rights to the WingMakers material...

I'm sorry to hear this...I have found the WM material extremely inspirational. Now I have to assume that's BS as well.


ChrisBowers's picture

Thank you for the heads up concerning Al Bielek.  I went on to listen to a 5-part interview David gave back some time ago (many of us have already heard it, but good to post it again) and David's mysterious Montauk Project friend/connection (aka Daniel) calls Al Bielek (having worked with him in the project) "a big storyteller" at about minute 8 on the first segment of the interview.  I would imagine it would be best to research Henry Deacon, Dan Burisch and Richard Hoagland, and leave Al Bielek to his own devices for now....

Here are the links to that 5-part Montauk Project interview....






In honor of the Love and the Light of the One Infinite Creator, all of this many-ness does spring from One single thought, and goes on forever in an ever co-creating construct.  We have absolutely no reason to think negative thoughts - thinking them only proves we prefer them, not that they are somehow empirically correct....

We are truly free to BE!!!!!

a few more links

The Enterprise Mission

Interplanetary "Day After Tomorrow?"

ChrisBowers's picture

UFO - Area 51

This 65 minute video features an interview with an alleged real alien (conducted at Area 51 by the Department of Naval Intelligence) from a downed craft in 1989 and a corresponding interview with "Victor" (wishing to remain anonymous), one of those involved with the activities in Dreamland, Groom Lake, Area 51.  Here are a few of my favorite quotes from what he and others said:

"The Beings seem to have a much easier time communicating spiritual concepts"

"Before understanding must come acceptance"

"Supernatural is just a term for aspects of nature we don't understand (yet)"

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Berry's picture


This was a very disturbing but enlightening video. Thanks for posting it.  I felt extreme compassion for this being who seemingly has offered itself to open communications with mankind and was suffering in its efforts to express concepts of which those questioning it had no inkling of understanding.

I must take time to consider the implications of this information, though I have known that such encounters have existed.  To see what is most obviously a real occurance takes me to another level of intellectual and spiritual choice.


With Light and Love brightening the dark side


ChrisBowers's picture

What is really intriguing is watching/listening to Dan Burisch speak on the subject and then watch UFO - Area 51 .  Much of what Dan talks about aligns well with Robert Lazar's, Sean Morton's, "Victor's" and Robert Dean's testimony in UFO - Area 51, not to mention much that Dr. Steven Greer has covered so exhaustively the past 20 years.

The Wingmakers story becomes all but blatantly obvious in light of much very similar testimony about folding of time and wormholes that are just one more part of nature that we will someday understand like we understand jumping in the car and going to the store.

I now believe it would have been ridiculous to make up the Wingmakers Ancient Arrow story when so much that is so obviously real is happening these days.  It is still possible that it is "technically a myth", as Bill Ryan said in an email to me months ago, but after looking at so much other very credible evidence so readily available today, I find it highly unlikely.  From all I have heard Bill and Kerry from Project Camelot say, and all that I hear (or don't hear) in their questions to guests, I strongly believe they need to read the Law of One material to get some answers to some of their questions.  With such close associations to David Wilcock, a very erudite student of the Law of One, I am surprised they have not journeyed there with the help of David, being that they claim they are sincerely looking for answers.  Maybe they are like so many of us in 3rd density, looking only for some answers.

There is so much in The Law of One and Secrets of the UFO that would fill in the blanks for them, but Bill is still reluctant to read that material for some reason as per one of David's email responses to me a while back.  So much more would make sense to them in relation to so much testimony they have heard from so many credible guests over the years if they would just open their minds just a little more and read the Law of One sessions.  I make no claims that Bill and Carla's work with Ra in 1981 is the only way to get a glimpse of this universal info of One - just that it is an excellent way to get it in spades, in such a delightfully neutral fashion....

Love/Light, Chris

p.s. here is Dan Burisch's testimony which compliments UFO - Area 51 so well, as well as David Adair's amazing story posted by Fred several months ago - enjoy!!!

Out from under Majestic: Dan Burisch uncensored

David Adair Interview - Rocket Scientist Claims He Touched Living UFO at Area 51

oh, and Berry, in response to your being a bit disturbed by our primitive treatment of EBE's willing to communicate with us "cavepersons" - what I came away with was how wonderful is their lack of fear of physical death and their understanding that they really cannot be harmed, that their spirit/souls simply move on to the next "vehicle" to be utilized in their ongoing and literally uninterrupted journey through and of Creation.  If enough throughout Creation understand this truth, in time, who would want to kill or harm if it just made them look silly and foolish?  It is our belief in death that has our tigers by the tail, not evil individuals that mean to do harm, wittingly or otherwise.

It is we who must ultimately give up being disturbed, for that would reveal a true and unbroken understanding of what Ra and so many others is/was trying to convey, wouldn't you agree???

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Berry's picture

 Brother Chris,

It was not so much that I was disturbed because of the likely death of the EBE, but because of the treatment and misunderstanding which it received.  I am overjoyed with that statement that they only consider the physical body as a vessel for the spirit. In accordance with your comment, this is perfectly in line with the LoO.   I just finished reading Carla and Don's early book (prior to the Ra transmissions) called the Crucifixtion of Esmerelda Sweetwater.  I am still subconsciously contemplating the compassion and sacrifice which is possible for and between humans (and Wanderers) and our cosmic family when there is an attempt to communicate the Love and Light of the Creator. Here is another must read for your library.  Find it in L/LResearch/Library.  This was written as a fiction some years before they ever heard of Ra or the Law of One, but the story revealed (almost as if channeled) a great deal of the Law of One concepts. Fascinating stuff.

I will take time to look at the two links re Dan Burish and David Adair.  I anticipate a strong confirmation from them. Thanks my friend.

With Light and Love brightening the dark side



P.S.  I got the Gregg Braden book, The God Code this week. WOW another great read.  I don't know how I am going to find time to absorb all the stuff that is out there now!!!


ChrisBowers's picture

yea, I was pretty sure you were not as "disturbed" as the use of the word in your comment would otherwise convey, but still took the opportunity to feature some of that more inspiring understanding that is coming from those like Dan Burisch and others who have come to know certain EBE's or J-rod 4500's (our future selves 45,000 years out in timeline one), and have intimately come to know first hand what "they" understand.  These testimonies continue to reveal a future much less bleak than our overactive imaginations swimming in the dark of 3rd density come up with over time at times.  I can't tell you how many times my dreams/imaginations have been much more scary than the actual reallity that comes in spite of it - seems to be somewhat of a natural phenomenon that can be trained out of existence with time and disciplined use of free will....

Also looking forward to reading The God Code and The Divine Matrix by Gregg Braden sometime soon too!  I have a CD of tones and sung YHVH chants based on The God Code that Gregg did with Jonathan Goldman.  I wish I could attach an MP3 file here, but it is one piece 72 minutes long, so it would be too big a file.  Do you have a PDF of the Crucifixion of Esmerelda Sweetwater already downloaded to your C-drive, or is it just a printed story on the LLResearch website?  If you do have a PDF, maybe you could attach it here or Book One of the Law of One in groups, or both???

Love/Light, Chris

Berry's picture

As a matter of fact I do have it downloaded as PDF. I will attach it.



With Light and Love brightening the dark side


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